irritating pencil tool problem

[moone]

Let's say I am using the pencil tool, tracing an image. I draw for a little bit, release the mouse button to reposition my hand, then click on the endpoint to continue drawing. But, sometimes, the selected line disappears and it starts to draw a completely new line. Has this happened to anyone else?

[The Repro Kid]

I used to get that problem with the brush tool when trying to draw calligraphy. I haven't done this in a while but started experimenting.

It seem that if you attempt to draw in a continuous curve, then there is no problem.

But, if you want to continue your curved line in an opposite direction, the type of curve you'd need to hold option with the pen tool, in order to make a corner point between curves, then the preceding line disappears. And holding option, like you do with the pen tool doesn't work, because option turns the pencil tool into an eraser.

I don't know how to get around it except by not actually touching the preceding anchor point.

Here's an example. The black and red lines represent where the pencil tool stops drawing and then starts back again.

[moone]

I appreciate the advice. I'll work on that.

[scottie]

I don't seem to have this problem. After you draw the first series press the apple key and click anywhere off the curves you've just drawn. This will unselect the curves you've drawn. Now draw more curve or whatever. If your going to continue remember to unselect the line you've drawn and continue. You can always use the join comman if you want a continuous line or a closed shape to be filed later. If your tracing (digitizing) a shape you sould really be using the pen tool. It's much more accurate. If your tracing with the mouse or even a pen you'll always be running off your pad.

[The Repro Kid]

I still find it odd (and irritating) that the pencil and brush tool have no problem, whatsoever, continuing to draw on a selected path (no deselecting necessary) when drawing a smooth-point curved line. But can't continue drawing on the same selected point when drawing a corner-point curved line, and instead, deletes the previous line. rather than join to it.

[GuyB]

In the pencil tool preferences (double-click on the tool) deselect one or both options ("Keep selected" and "Edit selected path") and you will be able to do what you want, even with a corner-point curved line.

[scottie]

Knowledge is power...
Someone's thinking, it may as well be you...Great find thanks.

[The Repro Kid]

In the pencil tool preferences (double-click on the tool) deselect one or both options ("Keep selected" and "Edit selected path") and you will be able to do what you want, even with a corner-point curved line.
You're right I can now draw a second line without the first being eliminated, but the points still won't join. It seems this still has to be done "command-j" style. This little quirk has been bugging me for a while. Although I wasn't the original poster, I've been hoping someone would straighten it out.

As for scottie, I don't think you ever quite grasped the notion of this whole thread, judging by the way you Poo-poo'd the original poster's desire to use the pencil tool, and advised that he use only the pen tool.
...you should really be using the pen tool. It's much more accurate.
I have several instances where I use the pencil tool and it comes in very handy. Scottie, If you can't think of an instance where people would use the pencil tool, perhaps you could turn to your bucket of brains for some insight, rather than altogether dismissing a tool's validity. :(

[scottie]

gee so angry...I guess that's how ROM came about.
I said "If your tracing (digitizing) a shape you sould really be using the pen tool. It's much more accurate.

It's very telling that you quote me with "...you sould really be using the pen tool. It's much more accurate."

I never said it sould never be used. Maybe you just need a nap.

[moone]

Good advice, thank you. It seems that where I click on the selected endpoint determines if the line disappears. But it is still hit or miss.

By the way, I create maps and infographics for a newspaper. I use the pencil tool because it is much more accurate when trying to trace a jagged coastline, or detailed boundary. Try tracing the coast of Norway with the pen tool...

[AdobeAce]

I use the pencil tool because it is much more accurate when trying to trace a jagged coastline, or detailed boundary. Try tracing the coast of Norway with the pen tool...

Hi Moone,

As an Adobe Certified Instructor, I can tell you that most users believe that the Pen tool is inaccurate, impossible, and frustrating until they master it.

I've drawn a lot of maps and I'd never dream of using a Pencil tool. It's like sculpting with a sledge hammer. When it comes to accuracy... Let's put it this way -- there's a good reason why Adobe does NOT provide a Pencil tool in Photoshop to draw paths for silhouetting images.

[The Repro Kid]

Good advice, thank you. It seems that where I click on the selected endpoint determines if the line disappears. But it is still hit or miss.

By the way, I create maps and infographics for a newspaper. I use the pencil tool because it is much more accurate when trying to trace a jagged coastline, or detailed boundary. Try tracing the coast of Norway with the pen tool...

moone, Adjusting the prefs the way GuyB stated worked for me. It was no longer hit or miss. As long as both option aren't checked your previous line should stay put.

And I know what you mean by making a conscientious decision to go with the pencil tool over the pen tool when tracing something irregular. I remember when I used to ink drawings with a french curve and a rapidograph. One day I had to ink the silhouette of a sheer mountain cliff with someone climbing up the face. I was using the french curve to ink out all the little kinks of the cliff. My boss stood over my shoulder a bit and finally said, "you know, if you don't put down that French curve, it's going to take you fours to draw what could be drawn in thirty seconds." I took his advice and got on with the job, and in thirty seconds my cliff was inked.

[The Repro Kid]

One of the most common ways I use the pencil tool is for what I like to call "Sketch and Trace."

It's a radical concept I know, making a pencil sketch and then tracing it with a pen. I don't know where I get these revolutionary ideas...

[AdobeAce]

Hi Repro,

You're absolutly right!

The Pencil tool is great for scetching, locking and the tracing over with the Pen tool. (Must be your traditional training in art.)

But if you had to be really accurate, wouldn't you use the pen tool?

Oh, by the way speaking of tracing -- Have you tried Live Trace and Live Paint in CS2.
It's kind of like Streamline only WAY better. What's best about it is it's an Effect until you Expand it. So you can keep changing your settings until you have exactly what you want. And not one error message about too many vector points for printing. Plus with Live Paint, no more gaps in line drawings which prevent coloring in shapes. I can't remember how many times I've had to do major surgury to the vector out of Streamline to make it work in Illustrator.

The attached (traced from a sketch by an illustrator friend, Harold Shull) was traced and filled in less than 5 minutes.

:D

[AdobeAce]

Let's try that again.

Notice the gap in the outine that's being ignored to allow filling of the shape with red.

Ace

[moone]

After I have played around with the settings, it seems that increasing the Fidelity solves the problem. When the fidelity is at .5, I get some funky looking endpoints, and this seems to cause the problem with lines deselecting themselves.

I have been using Photoshop for years, but trying to master Illustrator now, so I really appreciate the help.

Thanks for the tip, AdobeAce. I will work on using the pen tool more. By the way, very impressive portfolio.

[AdobeAce]

Thanks Moone!

My quick tip for learning the Pen tool --

Draw a circle with the Oval tool.

Lock it (Command + 2).

Now Trace the locked circle with the Pen tool.

Relax, take it slow. It's not rapid-fire target practice. (I've seen a lot of this in training)

Just click and drag out handles, keeping the end of the handle in BACK or your Anchor point the same distance from your locked circle as the Handle in FRONT of the Anchor point.

Remember, the handle BEHIND your Anchor point controls where the curve behind goes. The Handle in FRONT of the anchor point controls where the curve WILL go.

Try tracing the circle with eight Anchor points, alway trying to keep your Handles short -- never longer than half the distance back to the last Anchor point.

The more you practice, the less Anchor points you'll have to use to trace the circle. It can actually be done with as little as two anchor points.

Also, spend some time playing. Format some type and convert it to outline (Command + Shift + O). Select the type with the Direct Selection tool (Outlined White Arrow). Look at the handles to see how they're positioned, change the handles to see what happens. Virtually any shape can be drawn to perfection with the Pen using Corner Points and Curved Points with some practice.

Hope this helps!

Ace :D

[The Repro Kid]

Hi Repro,

You're absolutly right!

The Pencil tool is great for scetching, locking and the tracing over with the Pen tool. (Must be your traditional training in art.)

But if you had to be really accurate, wouldn't you use the pen tool?
... :D

Well yeah, that kinda is the pen tool.

Drawing over my own pencil tool sketch with the pen tool (which is what my dig. represented) is as acurate as drawing over my tracing paper and pencil sketch, as far as im concerned. I get along quick enough and never touch paper or scanner if possible. Obviously it is not optimum for choice works of art, but it seems to help my flow.

Confusing... I know. But that's actually use the pencil tool for the majority of the time I use it.

I like the pencil tool.